In the UnO2, is there a command or function similar to the "No Change" option in the old UnO?  Did I miss something in the manual (despite reading it through again, and searching the word "effect" and "preset")?  Maybe I'm even thicker than I thought I was...  :). I would like effects and their LEDs to maintain their current state (on/off) when I switch presets.  Here's my (pretty simple) configuration:

I think everything that you set as GLOBALSWITCH will keep the an effect the same across banks. 

And by default in Uno2, nothing changes unless you explicitly change it so the default behavior with out doing something is no-change.

Maybe I wasn’t clear…  Unless I read it wrong, the GLOBALSWITCH section simply inserts the same effects into every bank, unless you specify a change.  It appears to be a “clerical” option for convenience only, and does not get sent to the FCB.  I’m not trying to keep all my effects in the same place; I’m trying to keep them turned in when I change presets (not banks).  :)

The default behaviour is imperically not “do nothing”, as evidenced by the fact that when I change a preset, the effects that had been turned on, get turned off, and require a double-press of the effect button.  This is NOT a problem with the Kemper, as the UnO1 worked perfectly.

A Stomp will stay ON between FCB preset changes, but it will not SEND again unless you use SwitchOn in the new preset.

IOW - 

Stomp1 = OD
Stomp2 = phaser
Stomp3 = Delay

The preset can send:

 
Stomp2 (phaser) remains in its last state, the equivalent of No Change

Note that I'm working with the original UNO2, not the update. There may be something new in that version.

My guess is that when you send a program change to your device, Uno2 is not changing the effect but the device itself has defined a different effect for that particular program change. Maybe if you can extract an example from your code on what pedal you are pushing on what bank and what effect is being changed.  The FCB itself will not be aware of any effects changes that happen outside of the FCB, so indeed you would have to push the effect pedal twise to put it back in sync.

Essentially a program change on your device may do more than "nothing" to a given effect.

Not being argumentative, but with the previous UnO1 installed, and the “No Change” option selected in ControlCentre, the effects remain on even after a Program Change.  If the “no change” option isn’t chosen, it will display the same behaviour as is happening now, ie, LEDs stay on, but effects switch off.  The same will happen with the stock FCB firmware IIRC.  The difference is in how the UnO gets configured, not a setting within the Kemper.

As you can see above, my code is pretty simple; just defined amps, effects, banks etc., and actions.  My feeling is not that there’s anything wrong with UnO2, but that I’ve missed a command or an option in my UnO2 script.

I'm not sure who it is that you're not being argumentative with.

I'm not even sure that we're talking about the same thing.

The sample code you included is all about Expression pedals.

I THOUGHT you were asking about Stomps, which is where the ON/OFF/NO CHANGE settings were used on the UNO1 Chip.

It sounds like you're using presets to activate the Expression Pedals, using them like Stomps, then wondering why the LEDs go OFF when selecting a different preset? That's how the stock FCB chip works. UNO1 separates the Stomp functions from the presets, but allows you, when loading a preset, to choose which of the 5 Stomps sends ON (CC Value1, that LED ON), OFF (CC Value2, that LED OFF) or NO CHANGE. NO CHANGE left the Stomp's LED ON or OFF and READY to send the opposite Value but didn't actually send a message.

The method I described above, using SwitchOn StompName/SwitchOff StompName or nothing, mimics that behavior.
TBH, I never used NO CHANGE. I save my Helix (and plugin) presets with all FX OFF, then used the ON/OFF on load functions specifically when I loaded the preset. I still do that now with UNO2 and the SwitchOn/Off commands. That way I don't have to remember how the FX in the device presets are configured.

I've attached the template code that I use with Helix. I modify this code for specific needs by adding the Switch commands to the Presets and placing the Presets and Stomps on the grid as necessary for a specific use case - different songs, setlists, etc. I don't bother with fancy logic to tell the Expression pedals what to do, I just assign their CC#s to the effect in the preset and activate/deactivate them with the Tipswitch command which is configured globally. IDK, maybe you can't do that on the KPA.

I am talking about stomps, and am most certainly NOT trying to use expression pedals to control effect on/off, other than Tipswitch commands to enable Wah and Whammy, but that’s it.  Do you not see the section titled “Effects”, and the later section under the Presets section where there are “EFFECT_ON” and “EFFECT_OFF” commands?

In the “real world” (meaning real amps and pedals) the pedals on the pedalboard stay activated when you switch amp channels.  There’s nothing weird about wanting to duplicate that behaviour in the digital domain.

That said, after re-exporting my old UnO1 programming to UnO2 format and examining it in ControlCentre for UnO2, I didn’t see any difference in the syntax of the effects section of the script.  Then I opened the FCB and reinstalled the UnO1, and saw that in fact, I was incorrect; the FX state didn’t maintain its state during patch changes.  It must have been one of my other, retired rigs I was thinking of.

Thanks, for the update! That confirms what my thinking was.  

On Thu, Jan 12, 2023 at 10:22 PM, Moff40 wrote:

I am talking about stomps, and am most certainly NOT trying to use expression pedals to control effect on/off, other than Tipswitch commands to enable Wah and Whammy, but that’s it.  Do you not see the section titled “Effects”, and the later section under the Presets section where there are “EFFECT_ON” and “EFFECT_OFF” commands?

In the “real world” (meaning real amps and pedals) the pedals on the pedalboard stay activated when you switch amp channels.  There’s nothing weird about wanting to duplicate that behaviour in the digital domain.

You've misread and misinterpreted what I said, but whatever. I'm glad you got it all figured out and working right.

Actually, I want to thank you for the challenge. Compared to Helix and most of the plugins I work with, KPA has a very rigid MIDI implementation with the hard-coded CC assignments. In the course of trying to figure out the KPA and what you're doing I learned a couple of new techniques for working with this sort of MIDI implementation!

On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 12:50 AM, Moff40 wrote:

the GLOBALSWITCH section simply inserts the same effects into every bank ... and does not get sent to the FCB

Correct. 

This is NOT a problem with the Kemper

I wouldn't call it a problem with the Kemper, but it IS the behavior of the Kemper. Selecting a rig will also modify the effect states the way you have programmed them in the rig. This is exactly why UnO4Kemper firmware was created : that firmware has 2-way communication so that the Kemper can send the updated effect states to the FCB1010 after each preset change. Without 2-way communication you would need to copy the effect states for each preset to the FCB1010 setup in order to keep them in sync. With UnO firmware, that would be done by NOT using the "NoChange" option. With UnO2 firmware, that would be done by adding "SwitchOn" or "SwitchOff" commands to each preset.

the UnO1 worked perfectly.

There is no difference in behavior between UnO with "No Change" option and UnO2. Maybe at that time you didn't have the effects for each rig programmed the way they are now - you would need to re-install UnO to verify that there is indeed no difference.
 

On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 02:46 AM, Moff40 wrote:

If the “no change” option isn’t chosen, it will display the same behaviour as is happening now, ie, LEDs stay on, but effects switch off.  

That is also not correct. If the "no change" option isn't chosen, the effect LEDs will change along with the effect (de)activation.

I think there was a whole lot of misunderstanding and miscommunication during this thread.  I did confirm that UnO1 didn’t preserve the effects between patches either.  I’ve used the FCB with so many rigs, all I can say is I was confused.

On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 10:08 AM, Moff40 wrote:

I think there was a whole lot of misunderstanding and miscommunication during this thread.  I did confirm that UnO1 didn’t preserve the effects between patches either.  I’ve used the FCB with so many rigs, all I can say is I was confused.

ok, my bad - I didn't read all messages of the thread thoroughly

On Fri, Jan 13, 2023 at 02:59 AM, ossandust wrote:

I wouldn't call it a problem with the Kemper, but it IS the behavior of the Kemper. Selecting a rig will also modify the effect states the way you have programmed them in the rig. This is exactly why UnO4Kemper firmware was created : that firmware has 2-way communication so that the Kemper can send the updated effect states to the FCB1010 after each preset change. Without 2-way communication you would need to copy the effect states for each preset to the FCB1010 setup in order to keep them in sync. With UnO firmware, that would be done by NOT using the "NoChange" option. With UnO2 firmware, that would be done by adding "SwitchOn" or "SwitchOff" commands to each preset.

the UnO1 worked perfectly.

There is no difference in behavior between UnO with "No Change" option and UnO2. Maybe at that time you didn't have the effects for each rig programmed the way they are now - you would need to re-install UnO to verify that there is indeed no difference.
 

Thanks for this. It's the lack of 2-way communication ability in Helix and the plugins I use that led me to my standard method of saving the presets on those devices/plugins with all FX OFF and using the UNO1 per preset batch stomp change (clumsy, I forget what it was actually called) and the UNO2 SwitchOn/SwitchOff. It's really too bad that you can't do a 2-way communication chip like that for Helix and AXEFX. It wouldn't be as pretty, but the FCB + the chip would STILL be a far sight cheaper than the fancy floor controllers that L6 and FAS sell for those devices!

Xavier:  During this process, I pulled my licensed UnO2 and installed the UnO1.  Affer the experiment, I reinstalled the UnO2, it wants to be licensed again, but I get “You have already used your registration code”.  I saw elsewhere on this forum that the record in the license server simply needs to be reset.  Could you reset it for me please?  I have emailed you my registration info.  Thanks.  :)

On Sat, Jan 14, 2023 at 07:38 PM, Moff40 wrote:

 Could you reset it for me please?

Done.

Many thanks.  :)